Unconditional Love is for Children, Not Partners

00:00

Tired of toxic, boring, or dead-end relationships? Feeling lonely or clueless when it comes to love? Need a fresh perspective? Well, you found it. This is Romancipation, a podcast that challenges conventional ideas about sex, love, dating and mating. Hosts Marlee and Lis offer candid and provocative advice about what it takes to find the partner you deserve. 

00:30

It's time to rethink your approach to your love life. Take charge and get Romancipated. 

Marlee:

Today's topic. Unconditional Love is for Children, Not Partners. 

Lis:

Ooh. Okay. Well, I'm actually excited to hear what your take is on this one. 

Marlee:

Okay. I am well aware that what I just stated is probably not going to be too popular, but let me explain myself.

00:51

Lis:

Okay. 

Marlee:

Let me see if I can convince you differently. Part of, I think a healthy relationship is setting boundaries.

 Lis:

Yeah. 

Marlee:

Right? 

Lis:

Yeah. 

Marlee:

And when you set boundaries in a relationship, there are automatically conditions that are associated with those boundaries, right? You have to meet certain conditions. So, for example, if somebody's being disrespectful to you, if somebody's being abusive to you, if somebody is cheating on you, these are all examples of, I would argue a violation of boundaries. Okay? 100%. Certainly. Of my boundaries. 

01:23

Lis:

Yeah. 

Marlee:

My opinion, and I think of a lot of people's. 

Lis:

Yeah. Okay. 

Marlee:

So unconditional love is something that you give to a person, even if they repeatedly violate your boundaries. Hence the reason unconditional love is for children and not partners, right? 

01:41

Because when you have your children, you owe it to them too. 

Lis:

Yeah, of course. Love them no matter what something you do. 

Marlee:

Yeah, that's right. You can't control their personalities. You can't control their habits. You can't control anything about them. I know like people try, but the fact is nature's very strong and your kids will be who they will be, and you have to accept them, and you have to love them unconditionally even when they piss you off, even when they misbehave, even when they violate your boundaries. 

02:09

You have to love them because that is your job.

 Lis:

Yep. 

Marlee:

Let me just say your partner though. You choose. 

Lis:

That's right. You picked that puppy. 

Marlee:

You picked. That's right. You picked that puppy out of the litter, and if you got the runt that's on you, you choose your partner, meaning that you know what their personality is. 

02:28

You don't know your kid's personality until they pop out. You're like, oh, damn, you're like Uncle Charlie. 

Lis:

Yeah. 

Marlee:

You know what I mean? But you choose your partner, you know what their personality is. You know what their likes and dislikes are. You know what baggage they carry. As a result, you have the choice to say, yes, I want to be in a loving relationship with you, or no, I don't. 

02:49

The moment you choose to be in that relationship, you each have conditions that have to be met. You can love the person, but I would argue don't love them unconditionally. They have to meet certain conditions to get your love. 

Lis:

Okay. So yes, I am actually agreeing with you because I came into this thinking kind of more on a small level. 

03:11

So this is where I'm going to play a little bit of devil's advocate. 

Marlee:

Go ahead. 

Lis:

Because unconditional love can also mean offering love without condition in a particular moment, too. It doesn't have to be this grandiose boundary setting thing because I think that love is something that you give. 

03:30

So, I think that it can be on a smaller level and I'm giving you this love right now because you've been in love with multiple people, or at least what you felt was love over the course of your life. I'm sure I have. And so, when I was giving them that love in that moment, I was offering it unconditionally to a degree. 

Marlee:

You just contradicted yourself. You just said to a degree, unconditional love is just that. 

03:55

Here's the deal. Okay? 

Lis:

Yeah. 

Marlee: 

Okay. If my child ends up being a serial killer, let's hope he doesn't, but if he does… 

Lis:

You're still going to love him. Unconditionally. 

Marlee:

Well, yeah. I'm going to feel really bad about it. I'm going to be ashamed and everything, but the fact is he's still my child and I will still love him. And hence the reason when you watch court TV and you see like the families sitting behind these horrific monsters who’ve done awful things to society. 

04:22

And everyone's like, well, how can the family be supporting them? Uh, it's called unconditional love. Okay. That's why. But I can tell you if my partner ended up being a serial killer, are you kidding me? I'd be the first one on the stand testifying. 

04:36

Lis:

Like, I'm sorry. Yes. I turned him in. 

Marlee:

Yeah. But that's my point. Is that you absolutely have Conditions in a relationship and I personally think it's a red flag. Okay, big time. If a person now wants me, wants you to love them, unconditionally. It is a red flag because here's the deal. 

Lis:

Yes. 

Marlee:

Love isn't enough. Love isn't enough to sustain a relationship.

05:00

Lis:

Mm-hmm. And I think, yeah, you're right. Think too many. You're right. Many people get convinced that love is enough. Well, because you actually have to work for it too. Doesn't come easily. It's not something that's just out there floating around and there's varying degrees of it. Yeah, I hear you. Yeah.

05:13

Marlee:

So that's my argument. I do think that what you said is valid. I do think that there are moments. Where you offer unconditional support. 

Lis:

Ooh, okay. 

Marlee:

Not unconditional love. 

Lis:

I like that. Unconditional support because I was actually feeling really bad about myself. Thinking like, oh, unconditional love. It is hard, unconditional love. 

05:35

You're right. Is without condition and that's right. You're so right. I like the support. So, you can offer… I'm on team support. Yay. On team support. 

Marlee:

As long as you're not on life support. Okay. So unconditional is different than unconditional support. You can absolutely be there for somebody. 

05:55

You can accept them, you can listen to them, but that doesn't mean you have to offer unconditional love. Now you can offer unconditional like, 

Lis:

Okay, unpack that one. 

Marlee:

Unconditional like. There are times when my husband makes me absolutely insane. I fully admit, I think a choking him out. 

06:24

Oh, okay. I fully admit it, 

Lis:

And he should actually be very cautious. 

Marlee:

I fully admit it, and it's interesting because there will be times where I'm so angry yet he'll do or say something that instantly makes me laugh and it breaks my anger, and then I will realize I unconditionally like this guy. 

Lis:

I love that. Okay.

06:47

Marlee:

I unconditionally like him. I do. Yeah. I love him. But that's a whole other thing, right? He could do things that could crush my love but that doesn't mean that I wouldn't still like him as a person. I'll give you an example. I hope he doesn't cheat on me. I hope he never has cheated on me. I hope he doesn't. 

07:09

If he did, that would destroy my feelings of love for him. I know that well enough about myself. Okay? But he's got a great sense of humor. He is a really thoughtful, intelligent person. There's a lot of aspects of him that I just like, and I could imagine if he cheated on me and we ended up getting divorced and we were co-parenting, I might not love him anymore, but I could still like him. 

07:35

I would be livid with what he had done to me, but I could see myself getting to a point back of unconditional like, does that make sense? 

Lis:

It actually, really does. 

Marlee:

I just made that word up. 

Lis:

You really did. Unconditional like. You can like coin it and you know what, it's going to become the new dictionary word next.

07:51

Marlee: 

There you go. Unconditional like.  I think that liking a person is super important in a relationship. I actually would argue, Oh my God. Here we go. Here we go.  I would argue, Lis, that you should feel unconditional, like for a person as in your partner more than unconditional love. And I will tell you what I say to my kids. I say, I love you unconditionally, but, I do not like you right now. 

08:16

Lis:

Oh, now my gosh. I say that to my kids. 

Marlee:

So kids get unconditional love, but they don't get unconditional like. Partners and spouses get unconditional like, hopefully, but not unconditional love. Does that sound fair? 

Lis:

Yes. I like that. 

Marlee:

Great. 

Lis:

You know, I was going to say, I think that there's a distinct line between loving somebody through hardships and accepting unacceptable behavior too. 

08:41 

Marlee:

Great point. 

Lis:

That's all a part of the unconditional love is you shouldn't accept somebody disrespecting you and cheating on you. You had kind of mentioned that before, there's going to be points in life where things get tough and things are hard, and offering somebody love through that is, I would argue, something that is really important in a relationship. 

09:08

How do you differentiate that though, between unconditional love and that's just like a piece of loving them through hardships, right? Somebody loses a job, they lose a parent. That's just all a form of your love for them, right? 

Marlee:

Again, I'd say that's support. That's unconditional support. I wouldn't call it unconditional love. 

09:28 

I mean, listen, you are entitled to a different opinion. I'm just saying that's not what I would call it. You brought up in terms of somebody violating your boundaries, right? Like bad behavior. 

Lis:

Yep. Yeah, bad behavior. 

Marlee:

Yeah. I mean, look, when I say unconditional, like I'm not saying you just accept bad behavior from a partner. 

09:44

What I'm saying is that somebody can treat you poorly and violate your boundaries, but you still can like them. 

Lis:

Well, I like that you separated it. You separated out the like and the love piece of it. 

Marlee:

Yeah, and listen, if people have a hard time seeing it in a romantic relationship, this is where I'll bring in like in a friendship. 

10:08

How many times have you had a friend? You don't love your friend, but you like them and they violate your boundaries. 

Lis:

But then I've kind of discarded those friends. 

Marlee:

I disagree. I don't think you have. I don't think you've discarded all of them. Not all of them. 

Lis:

I think I've had a lot of friends on different levels.

10:24

Marlee:

I've had a lot of friends where, because I really like them as people. Okay. I've let them get away with a lot more. Okay. Oh my God. Wait. Epiphany here. Maybe I have to retract what I said because we cannot let our partners get away with bad behavior. Because we unconditionally like them. See, we're learning. 

10:44

I am going to retract unconditional like as well.

Lis:

We're here. Ok, we're dialing back on that one. 

Marlee:

I'm going to rephrase. Okay. I'm going to say unconditional love is for children, not partners. Unconditional like is for no one. 

It's venting time with Marlee and Lis.

Marlee:

It's that time when Lis and I get to vent our frustrations over commonly experienced issues in romantic relationships.

11:15

Lis:

And this is a good topic. 

Marlee:

It is. Okay. So, today's topic is When Your Partner Stays Too Friendly with an Ex. Okay, before I vent, I'm going to admit that prior to getting married, I did stay friendly with all my exes, so I'm putting it out there, but since I've seen the light, I'm reformed, so to speak.

11:38

Lis:

Okay. A reformed ex-friender.  

Marlee:

Yes. Okay. So, do you want me to start or would you? 

Lis:

Yeah. Take it away. 

Marlee:

All right. It creates seeds of doubt in the current relationship. 

Lis:

Mm-hmm.

Marlee:

It casts shadows over the new relationship, like a ghost of relationship's past. 

Lis:

Yeah. Okay. 

Marlee: 

It can create an environment for comparison between the current partner and the ex-partner. 

Lis:

Uhhuh.

12:02

Marlee:

It can create a feeling of competition between the current partner and the ex. 

Lis:

Yes. Who doesn't love a good competition? Yeah, just kidding. I'm kidding.  

Marlee:

It can create an opportunity for the ex to interfere or manipulate the current relationship. 

Lis:

Mm-hmm, you got it. 

Marlee:

It does not give proper closure to either person in the relationship. 

12:23

It can cause problems in your ex's relationship. 

Lis:

Ah-huh.

Marlee:

You can care about someone and value them without being in communication. 

Lis:

Yep. 

Marlee:

It can feel disrespectful to many people, especially your partner. 

Lis:

You're right.

Marlee:

It can cause insecurity in your partner that's completely unnecessary. 

Lis:

You're right. 

Marlee:

It can create jealousy for your partner. 

12:47

It can potentially lead the ex romantic partner on and make them think there's still a possibility to rekindle the relationship. 

Lis:

Ooh, good. 

Marlee:

It can make you and your current partner, uncomfortable of course. And finally, it's an ego thing. I fully admit that it's an ego thing and you’ve got to get past it.

13:08

Lis:

Yeah, good ones. 

Marlee:

Let me hear yours. 

Lis:

So, I think that there has to be some type of unresolved feelings by at least one of the parties. They're still having feelings for this other person, because there's always a little bit of a relationship imbalance. 

Marlee:

You're right. 

Lis:

You're, it's a little security blanket to fall back on just in case you don't find that next person.

13:26

Marlee:

Oh. 

Lis:

Maybe they're still good enough, right? 

Marlee:

Right. 

Lis:

Mm-hmm, even if you're not still sexually attracted, you can still have a dependency that makes you vulnerable. 

Marlee:

Right. 

Lis:

You've trusted this person with a lot of information. 

Marlee:

Right. 

Lis:

And then especially when they meet that new person just feels icky. 

Marlee:

Yeah. 

Lis:

If you're staying friends, they never had a chance to grieve the loss of the relationship and distance can always give a new perspective. 

13:50 

It gives you a chance to remember all of the bad things and the reasons that you actually weren't successful in that relationship and not just all of the good things that you're so tied to in the moment. 

Marlee:

Right. Great perspective, very insightful. Hmm. 

Lis:

Your ex can be a total cock block. 

Marlee:

Oh yeah. 

Lis:

And the friendship can leave you feeling like it's a consolation prize. 

14:13

You really wanted that relationship. It didn't work out. And now you're left with just a friendship. Even though you really wanted more. 

Marlee: 

You have blown my mind. Ooh, I am enlightened. Thank you, Lis. 

Lis:

I'm glad that my vents can do that for you. 

Marlee:

Yes. I feel like I am a lighter person now. 

Lis:

Ooh, vented away. 

Marlee:

Lis and I want to thank you so much for joining us this week. To view the complete show notes and a recap of today's podcast or to learn more about us, visit www.romancipation.com. 

14:41

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15:05

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