S6 Episode 9: School is in: Learn from Other’s Relationship Mistakes and Failures
Episode Summary
Relationships can be tricky. To make them work, you have to be willing to learn from past mistakes and missteps. We all slip up. It’s what we do after the fact that can help improve the relationship. Use your own prior romantic blunders, as well as those of your partner, as sources of knowledge on what not to repeat. Moreover, look to other people’s relationships to gain valuable insight about the strengths and weaknesses in your own partnership.
No person or relationship is perfect or unique. Do not fall into the trap of believing that there is no value in comparing your own relationship experiences with those of your family, friends, co-workers and neighbors. Use your observations of others’ relationship pitfalls as an opportunity to open discussions with your partner about infidelity, boundaries, finances, communication styles and expectations.
It is often easier to see problems with others’ behavior that you are blind to in your own life. If you are open to seeing similarities between your relationship and those of people with issues in their relationship, it may end up saving you from a lot of heartache.
At the end of each episode, Marlee and Lis vent about commonly experienced issues in romantic relationships. In this episode, the ladies discuss how unfair it is to be the one who is always in charge of being the disciplinarian of children or pets.
Show Notes
So many people miss out on the value of learning from another’s relationship mistakes. It’s important to reflect on your past relationships to move forward in a more productive way. But it’s also just as important to look to others and learn from the choices they’ve made—particularly the bad choices.
There’s so much valuable information you can glean and apply to your own life through the wisdom and experience of others. If you meet a person who hasn’t learned anything from their past relationship or from others, that’s a red flag. You can decide that your relationship is so unique so you can’t learn from others, but that’s a perspective that may come back to bite you.
The truth is that humans tend to behave in predictable patterns. Looking at and learning from your parents, siblings, friends, coworkers, and even celebrities can help you understand greater perspectives. You can use the outside examples within your own relationship and even communicate about how you might tackle similar circumstances together.
You and your relationship can benefit from another person's poor choices, but it doesn’t have to come from a place of judgment. Rather, you’re reflecting your relationship through another’s in an effort to make your relationship better. Other people’s mistakes can be preventative medicine for your romantic relationship.
In this episode, the vent session topic is: When a partner refuses to discipline the children or pet. When you’re the main enforcer, it can lead to tension in the household and between you and your partner. No one wants all of the responsibility of being the person who says no. The person who refuses to discipline is being immature.
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Visit us at www.romancipation.com
Tired of toxic, boring, or dead-end relationships? Feeling lonely or clueless when it comes to love? Need a fresh perspective? Well, you found it! This is Romancipation, a podcast that challenges conventional ideas about sex, love, dating, and mating. Hosts Marlee and Lis offer candid and provocative advice about what it takes to find the partner you deserve. It's time to rethink your approach to your love life. Take charge and get Romancipated.
Marlee:
On today's episode, School is in: Learn from Other’s Relationship Failures and Mistakes. Oh, Lis…
Lis:
This is a big one.
Marlee:
I really love this topic. And I love this topic because I think so many people miss out on the value of other people's fuck ups.
Lis:
Yeah.
Marlee:
Now, we have talked in the past about being aware of your own relationship past missteps. Right?
Lis:
Right. Taking a deep dive, kind of taking a after look at what went wrong, owning your piece of it. Yes.
Marlee:
Exactly. So that you can move forward and hopefully make the next relationship more productive and actually meet your wants, your needs, your expectations.
Lis:
Yup.
Marlee:
So, as important it is to do the self-exploration and the deep dive, I also think that it's really important to look to others and learn from the choices that they have made. Particularly, the bad choices.
Lis:
Right.
Marlee:
I mean, listen, we all want to learn from the good choices, and that's important too. But I also think that when you look at other people's choices, particularly in romantic relationships, and you see the mistakes, the pitfalls, whatever they do that ended a relationship for them in a negative way, I think you can gleam so much valuable information that then you can apply to yourself and instead of you jumping off the bridge, you so to speak, you let the other person jump first.
Lis:
Did you push them?
Marlee:
No, but I mean if they go splat, you know not to jump off the bridge.
Lis:
Exactly.
Marlee:
Right?
Lis:
Exactly.
Marlee:
So, I am a huge proponent of this. I think that it's great to not only talk to your partner and ask them, “What were your past mistakes in relationships? Where do you think you went wrong? What have you learned from it?” Because, Lis, it is so telling if the person you're talking to is like, “What mistakes? It was all my ex.”
Lis:
Oh, Marlee. Oh my God.
Marlee:
Right?
Lis:
Yes. Oh, red flag. Huge red flag!
Marlee:
Yeah, if somebody can't recognize that their past relationship, unless their past relationship ended because somebody died and it wasn't a murder, unless they are a widow or a widower, the relationship ended.
Lis:
Right.
Marlee:
And it ended either because it was a mutual decision or one person in the couple decided they no longer wanted to be in this relationship.
Lis:
Right, but also, no relationship is perfect.
Marlee:
Of course not.
Lis:
There are mistakes to go around in every single relationship.
Marlee:
That's right.
Lis:
It's how you own it and how you perceive the mistakes and carry them forward with you or you realize that those were mistakes and you own your part in it and you move past it.
Marlee:
Absolutely.
Lis:
Right? That's right. I mean that is what it’s all about.
Marlee:
It's part of accountability. It's part of taking personal responsibility.
Lis:
Yes.
Marlee:
It's part of acceptance.
Lis:
That's right.
Marlee:
That allows you to move forward. But it also, I think, reinforces the strong foundational traits that you and I always talk about in terms of a relationship. Right. When you recognize that maybe in your last relationship, you violated your ex's boundaries.
Lis:
Right. Scrolling through his phone.
Marlee:
That's right. Well, there you go. You know not to do that.
Lis:
Right.
Marlee:
If you know in the past relationship, you had trust issues, you get to explore why you had those trust issues and how you get to avoid that particular pitfall that you’ve experienced.
Lis:
Right. And not to project it on your new relationship.
Marlee:
Exactly. So not only do I think it's a great preventative medicine type of situation to talk to each other about past mistakes, but I think it's great to also talk about everybody else around you past mistakes or current mistakes if they are on-going.
Lis:
Why is it so easy to be able to point out other people's mistakes and not your own.
Marlee:
Because you don't have any skin in the game, right? But, here's the deal. You can either take the attitude that my relationship is so unique, so fabulous, I couldn't possibly experience the same things as other people. You can take that worldview, it's naive, it's ridiculous, it's short sighted, and it will come back to bite you in the ass. Or, you can have a wider, broader perspective and say, you know what? Humans tend to behave in predictable patterns in general.
Lis:
Yep.
Marlee:
So let me look at my parents. Let me look at my sibling’s relationships. Let me look at cousins, co-workers, friends, neighbors, even celebrities, you know.
Lis:
Good point.
Marlee:
Let me look at their behaviors, their choices.
Lis:
Yes.
Marlee:
And obviously you're not going to be privy to all of the details. I mean, sometimes you might have intimate knowledge, but often it's only from one perspective.
Lis:
Well, I was going to say you're only getting one perspective.
Marlee:
But it's also from your own personal observations.
Lis:
Right.
Marlee:
And take the little nuggets of wisdom that you can get from this. So, my husband and I, we do this all the time. Watch now, you and your husband are going to go to dinner with us again. But what we do is, if we interact with another couple, we will then come home. And it's not that we're dissecting the other couple, because we're not. It's if there's aspects of their relationship that we observed that we felt were something we'd like to emulate.
Lis:
Yeah.
Marlee:
That's great. But if there are things we observed that we thought, ugh, I want to avoid that. It's a great way to start a discussion.
Lis:
Yeah.
Marlee:
And I know that I have personally learned a lot about my husband's point of view by just hearing his observations, right? What his perspective of what he saw go down. So let's take the example of spending.
Lis:
Okay.
Marlee:
You see a lot of couples where there will be mismanagement of finances and it creates conflict. And sometimes you'll hear a story. Maybe the couple is telling you that they made a purchase that they ended up regretting.
Lis:
Bought a new boat.
Marlee:
There you go.
Lis:
Okay.
Marlee:
And one partner was pro buying it and the other one was anti buying it.
Lis:
Yep.
Marlee:
Right? It's usually the case. Not always, but...
Marlee:
Usually the case.
Lis:
Yeah.
Marlee:
But I find it fascinating because I'll hear each of their perspectives, and I know which side I'll fall on.
Lis:
Yeah.
Marlee:
But sometimes I'm surprised by the side that my husband will fall on.
Lis:
Interesting.
Marlee:
Because he's maybe looking at it from a different way than I was.
Lis:
Of course.
Marlee:
But it then opens up a discussion for us to have if we ever decided to make, let's say, a purchase like a boat. What would we want to be discussing? What were the pitfalls that this other couple went through that they didn't discuss? Was it that they actually couldn't afford the boat? Was it that they didn't think about how much time they had to actually use the boat? Was it that somebody actually had fear of water?
Lis:
No, I think that’s brilliant.
Marlee:
Whatever it might be, is that it opened up the ability to have these conversations about our wants, our needs, our expectations, right?
Lis:
Yes.
Marlee:
Even how we communicate about things.
Lis:
Ding-ding, I was going to say, I think that it gives you a great opportunity to talk about how you would communicate together in that type of situation, because whether or not, like you said, there's always probably somebody that wants something a little bit more, right?
Marlee:
Yeah.
Lis:
Like, especially on a big purchase, and so in their head, they're thinking about all the ways that they're going to use this new boat, right? We're going to go fishing, we're going to take family out, we're going to go tubing, we're going to bring it here. And you're right. And maybe from the other person's perspective, there's like not enough time in the calendar year to allocate to all of these great adventures that your partner is thinking of having.
So, being kind of a fly on the wall and being able to dissect that with your husband I think is actually kind of brilliant because it opens up a different way to communicate about things because you know, as well as I do, when somebody is super excited about you, you become irrational. Right?
Marlee:
Yeah. Absolutely.
Lis:
Like your thought process is like one trick pony. You are focused solely on that one purchase. So all the other stuff flies out the window. So if you've already got it into your like wheelhouse, how you're going to communicate, I think it's a great place to start.
Marlee:
That’s right. I'll also tell you, my husband's gotten more sex because of me hearing about people having affairs. Because I'm like, “Oh god, I’ve got to put out. All right!” You know, I mean, but you laugh. I mean, I'm kidding, but I'm not. You hear about marital breakdown. And maybe it's because, again, people have different sexual appetites.
Lis:
Yep.
Marlee:
And you then take a step back and go, wait a second, hmm, all right, well, I don't want to fall into that trap, so I'm going to have to maybe bring it a little more.
Lis:
Yup.
Marlee:
Sometimes you are able to use other people's poor choices or bad decisions and get a benefit from it. And it's not that you're judging those people. It's not that you want bad things to happen. But it's that you're using them as a mirror, right? You're reflecting your relationship with theirs.
Because we've talked about this before. People compare relationships all the time. That's how they kind of decide whether or not it's a positive or a negative. And I can tell you that when I look at other people's relationships, I will absolutely, it's human, I will assess in my own brain, do I think that's a strong relationship?
Lis:
Yup.
Marlee:
Do I think that's a weak relationship? And why?
Lis:
Yeah.
Marlee:
And then I will apply it to my own relationship. And I'll say, “Oh wait a second, we're weak there too. We need to shore that up. We need to strengthen that. Or, oh, you know what? Yeah, I think we're strong in this, but let me do a check in. Let me talk to my husband.”
Does he feel the same way? Because it could be that I feel confident that we'd be on the same page about something or that everything's solid, and he might be feeling a completely different way.
Lis:
Yeah.
Marlee:
So, like I said, preventative medicine. Other people's mistakes are amazing at allowing you to kind of catch yourself before you fall into the same patterns. Or if you are in the same patterns, to be able to put the brakes on it and actively change it because you can kind of see where things are going. I know that that happened with my husband and I when we had kids.
Lis:
Interesting.
Marlee:
We saw how other couples who had been super tight were being pulled apart because the woman was so focused on the kids and the man was feeling kind of neglected and ignored and he started sort of drifting off and…
Lis:
Sorry, I'm like, waah!
Marlee:
Well, yeah, but no.
Lis:
It happens a lot.
Marlee:
As a result, my husband and I made a very distinct and thoughtful decision that we would always make sure to have date nights, that we would always make sure to prioritize our marriage because we didn't want anything to happen that we saw happening in some of our friends. And I think that you see that a lot when people have bad experiences growing up, when they see their parents in a bad marriage, they will desperately try to not repeat that pattern.
Lis:
Right.
Marlee:
And unfortunately, if they're not fully aware of why that pattern happened to begin with, they end up not only repeating it, but often it gets worse.
Lis:
Oh, making it one hundred percent worse. Yeah.
Marlee:
So that's why I think it's really important to identify other people's mistakes and learn from them.
Lis:
No, I think listen, I think that's great. And I think what it also does is give you a window into yourself, right?
Marlee:
Yes.
Lis:
Because like you just said, you're watching what you're perceiving as somebody's mistakes, but to them, that might not be anything meaningful.
Marlee:
Oh, that's a great point. It might not be a mistake to them.
Lis:
It's not a mistake to them, but what you're witnessing, you realize in yourself that would cross a boundary or that would be unacceptable in your relationship. And so, I think the whole point that you made was brilliant because I do think that it is so much about communicating and knowing and understanding your own boundaries and what you're willing to let go of versus what you're not. Because a lot of people, there's a gray area where to them it might not be that big of a deal.
Marlee:
Yeah. No, I think that when you look at other people's mistakes in relationships, it also creates an empathy.
Lis:
Yeah, great point.
Marlee:
I do.
Lis:
Yeah.
Marlee:
I think that you can look at that person and actually feel empathetic and then you can bring that empathy into your relationship. I know that I have seen couples where I think one member of the couple is being unfair to the other member. And then I will take a step back and I'll have an oh shit moment and I'll be like “Yikes, whoa, that sounded just like me yesterday. Holy crap, I am not being fair to my husband right now.” It gives me empathy in a way more so than if he had said to me, “You're not being fair to me”, I'd be like, “Yeah, I am.”
Lis:
Exactly.
Marlee:
Right? But because I got to observe a very similar behavior.
Lis:
Right. Yeah.
Marlee:
And I was thinking as an outsider, wow, that's a kind of bitchy, man. And I'm like, yikes! That was me yesterday! But other times I'm very empathetic towards the person and I'm like, yes, that’s right, you tell him.
Lis:
Exactly. Go to town, go to town.
Marlee:
That's right. Yes. That's what I just want people to understand is you do learn a lot from other people. And the moment you take that attitude of oh, well, my relationship's different, that couldn't happen to me. That's when it happens. The best tactic is always to assume that anything and everything can happen in your relationship and therefore you should be prepared for the worst-case scenario so that you're not caught off guard.
You kind of have a sense of how things are going to unfold. You hope for the best. But you prepare for the worst. And I know that sounds like a negative Nelly way of thinking of things, but it's just like the exit strategy. The more holistically you look at your relationship, the more you are willing to really understand what it takes to make it work.
And if you in fact want to make it work and you're willing to put in the effort, because let's face it, every relationship has ups and downs and there's going to be time it takes more effort than other times.
Lis:
That’s right.
Marlee:
If you recognize that you want this relationship and you're going to nurture it, then what you do is you look out for any of the potential issues that could arise.
It's like if when you baby proof a home before a kid comes, right? You get down on your hands and knees and you look for anything dangerous.
Lis:
Yeah.
Marlee:
Right.
Lis:
Oh yeah. All those plug outlets. Yeah, yeah.
Marlee:
But that's what I mean. It's similar. You are taking in information from outside sources.
Lis:
Yep.
Marlee:
And you're looking at your own relationship and you're trying to keep it safe…
Lis:
And baby proof it.
Marlee:
And baby proof it. Well, some people might definitely want to baby proof a relationship, but exactly, you're trying to protect it. And I think that's a really important thing.
It's venting time with Marlee and Lis.
Marlee:
It's that time when Lis and I get to vent our frustrations over commonly experienced issues in romantic relationships.
Today's topic, When a Partner Refuses to Discipline the Children or Pet.
Lis:
Oh my gosh, yeah.
Marlee:
Alright, so do you want to go for this?
Lis:
Yeah, oh my lord.
Marlee:
Okay, you go first.
Lis:
Okay, so if you're the main authoritative kind of partner, and setting and enforcing rules, boundaries and consequences, it can sometimes feel as if the other partner isn't sharing in the same overwhelming responsibility.
Marlee:
Yes.
Lis:
I mean, it's overwhelming. There's no balance of power, so not only do your kids feel the effects of the imbalance, but the tension really starts to, like, eke in and grow between the two partners. I mean, it just oozes.
Marlee:
Absolutely.
Lis:
It's hard not to resent the partner that doesn't discipline the kids or take care of the pet, and no one wants all of the responsibility of being the rule maker. Hey, sometimes, like, you want to be the fun guy too, right? Like, you don't always want to have to be the person that says no.
Marlee:
Absolutely.
Lis:
And also keep in mind that it's okay for one person to be more of a disciplinarian than the other. As long as everyone feels that their voice is being heard, you always have to have a balance.
Marlee:
Yes, excellent points. Okay, so mine are very similar.
Lis:
Okay.
Marlee:
Very similar to yours. So, I think this can be very frustrating because it makes one person the disciplinarian and therefore the meanie.
Lis:
That's right.
Marlee:
And the other person gets to be the nice or preferred partner.
Lis:
Oh, yeah. So, totally agree with you.
Marlee:
It creates a power imbalance that ends up impacting the dynamic of the family.
Lis:
Yep.
Marlee:
I think it shows a lack of empathy for the person who's stuck in the disciplinarian role.
Lis:
Yes.
Marlee:
Right? Always having to be like the hard ass. I absolutely think it causes resentment in the relationship. I think the person who refuses to discipline is being very immature.
Lis:
Yes.
Marlee:
Always wanting to be the one that's seen as the nice one.
Lis:
That's right.
Marlee:
I think it can create long lasting damage between the child or animal that was subject to the discipline and the person who took on the role of the disciplinarian in the relationship.
Lis:
Absolutely.
Marlee:
Right?
Lis:
Yeah.
Marlee:
Like a dog is always going to go to the person that gives it a treat, not the person that stops it from sitting on the couch, right?
Lis:
One hundred percent.
Marlee:
Same with the kids.
Lis:
Yeah.
Marlee:
They're not allowed to sit on the couch either. It can cause anger and depression. I think in the person who's forced to take on the disciplinarian role.
Lis:
Yeah.
Marlee:
It sucks to always be the negative person.
Lis:
That's right.
Marlee:
I think it demeans the concept of a partnership, which is you have to share in the joys as well as the burdens.
Lis:
Totally agree.
Marlee:
I think it allows the partner that refuses to set boundaries with children or pets to create unnecessarily serious issues that end up impacting everyone.
Lis:
Yup.
Marlee:
I think it's often a sign that the person who refuses to set those boundaries with the individuals or creatures they're in charge of is usually a reaction to not having healthy boundaries growing up themselves. Right? They're almost overcompensating in some way.
Lis:
Yes.
Marlee:
And I think the person may be afraid of making the same parenting or pet ownership mistakes.
Lis:
Ooh. Yeah.
Marlee:
Right? That they had observed growing up. I think some children can read a lack of boundaries and discipline as meaning the parent doesn't actually care about them or their well-being. So again, I think the person who refuses to set boundaries and refuses to discipline is actually sending a very different message than they intended to send to children.
Lis:
They thought they were being fun.
Marlee:
That's right.
Lis:
But at the same time…yeah.
Marlee:
I think the children interpret it in some way of you care more about having fun with me than keeping me safe. And then I also think that when you refuse to share in the role of being the disciplinarian, it really does violate that concept of being a team or family unit. Again, playing off on this idea of partnership.
Lis:
That's right.
Marlee:
I think that everybody has to have a role, but everybody has to take on good as well as bad. This vent is a serious one because I see it often.
Lis:
Yep.
Marlee:
My husband and I, we share the disciplinarian role on purpose because our children then never know who to play because they know, right, that whoever they go to is just as likely to punish them as the other.
Lis:
That’s right. Good points.
Marlee:
Lis and I want to thank you so much for joining us this week. To view the complete show notes and a recap of today's podcast, or to learn more about us, visit www.Romancipation.com. Before you go, make sure you subscribe to the podcast so you can receive notifications of new episodes right when they're released.
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